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Happy
10-04-2012, 02:18 PM
Learning more about depression in animals could one day benefit humans, say scientists who believe that mammals share the same basic wiring in their brain for emotions as humans do.

Depression is diagnosed in humans based on a list of symptoms that are all very subjective. Common core symptoms include feelings of guilt, thoughts of death, and loss of pleasure. Because animals can't communicate even if they have these kinds of experiences, strictly the answer is: We can't say.

http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2012/10/121004-animals-depression-health-science/

LPC
10-13-2012, 05:01 PM
You don't need to communicate with words. Their facial expressions and behaviour are enough!

bhawk
10-16-2012, 08:46 PM
Depression is a well known occurrence in many animals. However, as the previous poster says, it is not found by looking at their facial expressions! how does a parrot frown?
Animal behaviour is not the same as humans, its a common thing for well meaning people to believe they can tell an animals feelings by how the animal holds itself. One which stands out to me is a friend of a friend telling me a peregrine i had was sad in its environment....when the bird was is full courtship display to me!

LPC
10-17-2012, 11:36 AM
Actually, I wrote "facial expressions and behaviour". In your case, the peregrine sounds to have been happy at that moment! I see that you are a falcon breeder, so you should know a lot about such birds.

However, I'm glad that you agree that animals are just as capable of emotions are we are. This can be observed by their behaviour, comportment and/or facial expressions, depending on the animal.

knightofalbion
10-18-2012, 04:48 PM
Animals have feelings and emotions, and souls, just as we do. It is a sop to the conscience of those who make a living out of abusing animals, or who enjoy the fruits of such abuses, to deny or sweep under the carpet, these great truths.

knightofalbion
10-18-2012, 05:01 PM
As to the specific point of depression in animals. Indeed, animals can get depressed, for a number of reasons. Isolation/loneliness - most animals are sociable creatures; boredom - animals esp. domestic pets like dogs need exercise and activity to stimulate them; fear - all creatures want to live in peace, and in the case of pets , want kind owners...

Demeanour betrays an animal's mood. In the case of dogs for examples, ears & head may droop, the creature may be cowed, the tail hung low...All signs of unhappiness of spirit.

I remember going to a zoo when I was a very young boy. Do animals get depressed? Anyone who had visited that zoo (one of the better ones in the day - didn't say much for the others...) wouldn't need to ask such a question. Animals pacing back and forth or sitting slumped against the wall...Pitiful.

bhawk
11-18-2012, 04:07 AM
Fear itself rarely causes depression, by that statement humans who watch horrors should be hanging themselves daily. Not only that, how do you think wild prey species cope? animals can literally die through depression, much as humans can, through despair and grief they will simply not feed themselves, its been known in dogs that lose their owners amd even in pigeons amongst many others. Fear is a survival mechanism, it makes the animal fight or flee. The only time fear has been known to cause depression is when the fear is sustained for periods of time, such as in severe animal abuse, the fear in those situations however may merely be a contributing factor as the abuse may be the primary cause.

Demeanour can display an animals mood but again as i pointed out before, you cant rely on it unless you are trained in that animals behaviour.

You also seem to forget how far zoo's have come, yes in the past many were abhorrent places of a mere existence, now however, the zoos are regulated and the animals welfare is always the top priority.

LPC
11-18-2012, 07:35 AM
now however, the zoos are regulated and the animals welfare is always the top priority.
Are you sure about the word "always"?!

knightofalbion
11-18-2012, 08:59 AM
1) Fear itself rarely causes depression, by that statement humans who watch horrors should be hanging themselves daily. Not only that, how do you think wild prey species cope? animals can literally die through depression, much as humans can, through despair and grief they will simply not feed themselves, its been known in dogs that lose their owners amd even in pigeons amongst many others. Fear is a survival mechanism, it makes the animal fight or flee. The only time fear has been known to cause depression is when the fear is sustained for periods of time, such as in severe animal abuse, the fear in those situations however may merely be a contributing factor as the abuse may be the primary cause.

2) Demeanour can display an animals mood but again as i pointed out before, you cant rely on it unless you are trained in that animals behaviour.

3) You also seem to forget how far zoo's have come, yes in the past many were abhorrent places of a mere existence, now however, the zoos are regulated and the animals welfare is always the top priority.

1) Many animals live in a state of constant fear, due to the cruelty of man, be it as a hard-hearted owner or through persecution.

2) One doesn't need a PhD to discern sorrow and depression in an animal. Indeed, one would have to have a pretty dull heart not to 'see' it...

3) Zoos in many parts of China, Eastern Europe and South America still have appalling and totally inappropiate levels of housing their unfortunate inmates.
Whilst zoos in Western Europe have improved greatly in recent years the walls, bars and moats are still there - and for a reason.

bhawk
11-18-2012, 10:15 AM
I have spent time in zoo's and the main reason for the bars and moats is mainly for the protection of the people, you will always get one person who will try reading a bible to a tiger (which did happen abroad, and he got mauled to death)
As for zoo's abroad, and animal treatment in general it is definitely a sad state of affairs, the compassion many hold in the west for animals is not a worldwide phenomenon unfortunately. This needs to be addressed but it is only going to happen by the power of the public, the governments dont want to change things as they are.

You still miss my point about the languages beign different between species, if you can tell me the signs of a depressed falcon i would be impressed!

knightofalbion
11-18-2012, 04:24 PM
I have spent time in zoo's and the main reason for the bars and moats is mainly for the protection of the people.
still miss my point about the languages beign different between species, if you can tell me the signs of a depressed falcon i would be impressed!

They're there to stop the animals making a break for freedom, as they would do given the chance. No animal wants to be imprisoned anymore than a human being does.
And no bird wants to be imprisoned within a cage either.
As your falcons. Maybe they are happy to stay with you. Maybe they ache for their freedom. Why not quit tethering them and find out the answer.

jessewills
11-25-2012, 11:38 PM
Yes, they can get depressed when they loose one of their fellow, the others go into depression.

bhawk
12-01-2012, 03:03 PM
My falcons are flown daily, they are free, they can fly away any time they want yet they dont, When i was younger i had a redtailed hawk, he did fly away....6 months later while walking home from school he appeared from nowhere and followed me home and flew into his aviary of his own accord, so your assertion that animals are happier when "free" is nonsense.
To take your idea full circle i hope you have released your pet dog! It deserves to be "free"

alex075
05-07-2013, 08:26 AM
I agree animals are also encountering depression specially if they are been played and sometimes it cause them death.In Finland i seen many eläinsairaala järvenpää (http://www.jar-vet.fi/) or animal hospital that taking good care of some abandon pets and most of the time they are always encountering a depress pet which only need to free specially those who gets in wild.